FI Loom Problem - The Fix

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FI Loom Problem - The Fix

Postby bezzer » Tue Sep 14, 2004 10:26 pm

As you know my bike has been playing up with the FI light and cut out a few times. The local Honda dealer where it originally came from shut down a few years ago and we haven't got a local one now. Tried the nearest 3 which are all a bit of a distance 2 didn't want to know as it wasn't from there "come back in a month or two when we aren't busy" and he third tested it but couldn't get any fault codes so wouldn't take it any further, "wait until it breaks down fully" :banghead)
I apologise for the quality of the pics but I'm not taking it apart again just to get some good ones.

So decided to have a look and see what I could do with it. For those that don't know this is the location, the main thick harness to the left of the left side passenger foot, a gob of tape stuck to the underside of the harness.
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The loom is pretty tight at this point so I had to unplug a few nearby connectors and the main earth point just below the tank to give enough movement to pull the loom down a bit to get some working space.
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Cut away the insulation and this is the connector, not a straight through male and female block to join wires up but a dead end 20 pole connector with 19 connected wires, think it's a diagnostic "thingy" but it doesn't show on the Haynes wiring diagram that I can see :banghead)
Image
Last edited by bezzer on Wed Oct 06, 2010 6:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby bezzer » Tue Sep 14, 2004 10:43 pm

Took the thing apart but it took a bit of persuading as the corrosion was binding it and this is what I ended up with, doesn't show very well but well furred up
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Used contact cleaner, soft and brass brushes, emery cloth and needle file to clean the male and female contacts and it came up quite good

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My original idea was to cut and join the pair of wires with solder, heat shrink etc but it didn't turn out that way, there are 19 wires, 14-15 are earth related they all go into the main part of the block singly but the male connectors in the bottom part of the block join one complete row together then join the other row into three lots of three. It can be done but I thought I'd give the clean up method a go first and try it out.

After cleaning, doused both parts in ignition sealer(Holts puts on a clear plastic coat), put them back together, covered the outside with it as well, followed by a spray of silicone grease. Taped it all up and instead of putting it under the loom where it becomes the lowest point and collects all the moisture (no wonder it fails) cable tied it to the subframe rail just above the loom making it the highest point.
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Put everything back together after spraying and silicon greasing every connector I could see and it started first time. Just got to run around for a bit now to see if it's properly cured it, if not Plan B comes into effect and I'll cut the block off and hardwire everything.
Well worth doing if you've got a 99 or 00 bike just for peace of mind, must have read about at least 15 bikes that have had the problem this year and that will be the tip of the iceberg.

Nearly forgot Don't forget to disconnect the battery before you start just to make sure

29.11.2004 An update....BOLLOX
Well it lasted about 3 months then the FI light starting coming on with the front brake switch. No problems cutting out etc but obviously a duff connection somewhere......so today I hardwired it.
The block of 10 have to go together then the 3 blocks of 3 as well. Cut the wires off the connector on the 3x3 side first..they are in their own colours so you don't get to mix them up.
When I stripped the insulation off the copper wire was black for a fair way up, there isn't really enough length to try and cut them back to perfect shiny copper so I cleaned them with a small wire brush and contact cleaner. Soldered the three wires together then used 2 layers of heatshrink tubing to seal them
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For the main block of 10 the easiest way is to leave the main thicker earth on its own, solder the remaining 9 into three blocks of three. Used a small piece of heatshrink to hold all of them together then dipped them into a "thimble" full of heated/melted solder, sprayed a bit of water on it to cool it down and ended up with all ten soldered together.
Heatshrinked them, covered everthing in silicone grease and taped everything up to the main loom using self amalging rubber tape to seal it.
Image

Started first time, FI light hasn't come on and hopefully thats it. I can see that when it does start to go you might as well hardwire it. If damp has got in to the terminals it has also got into the actual wire and connections as well which you can't clean up so it is going to go again anyway.

Just come back to this thread to stick the pictures back up that had disappeared. Over the 6 years it's been reposted and copied on most Blackbird Forums and as the years have passed it turns out Honda didn't cure the problem after the 1999-2000 bikes, all FI bikes can get the same FI light problems, the connector has moved to further back on the left side and some on the right side, even has different amount of wires BUT it can be cured by following the above instructions just make sure with a multimeter which wires should be joined to which and you won't go wrong. If an FI light problem occurs do the permanent fix, don't bother with just a clean up, some people have done that and ended up having to replace stators, reg/recs and even ECUs because it soon gave problems again. It might not be the cure for all ills but if in doubt do the fix and at least that way you've got rid of one variable for little or no cost.
Last edited by bezzer on Wed Oct 06, 2010 6:51 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Postby Chrixx » Wed Sep 15, 2004 4:37 pm

Looks like a good fix Bezzer 8)
This looks like the problem area we were warned about before and covered by the Honda warranty.

I did look at mine several months ago ('99 model) but there was only the slightest hint of corrosion. It never rains here so it must be due to me washing the dust away!

Just cleaned it with non-residue contact cleaner, silicon spray and re taped it up a bit higher. There was no indication of a problem and I don't expect there to be any but there was nothing else to fiddle with on the bike, it's so reliable. :banghead)
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Postby Simon S » Fri Sep 17, 2004 1:24 pm

That top shot has flared coz you used a flash :mrgreen: :roll)
Good fix :thumbsup) though Bezzer
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Postby bezzer » Fri Sep 17, 2004 1:44 pm

No shit :roll) , it was in the fookin garage and getting dark, wasn't a photo shoot wasn't going to use spots or daylight I took it apart and put it back together again. :wink)
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Postby Chuff » Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:24 pm

bezzer wrote:No shit :roll) , it was in the fookin garage and getting dark and i am too tight to turn the lite on :wink)


:D
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Postby TazCBR1100XX » Fri Sep 17, 2004 5:47 pm

A bit fookin critical aren't we Simone :? :D
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Postby Simon S » Fri Sep 17, 2004 8:11 pm

TazCBR1100XX wrote:A bit fookin critical aren't we Simone :? :D

Sorry Taz but that quality of shot is just not aceptable on this site anymore lol :|
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Postby studleyroger » Sat Sep 18, 2004 7:04 pm

well done, thats a great fix, had the same problem once on a range rover, couldent get the thing started for 6 months, turned out to be a connecter like the one on the xx , that went in to the computer under the seat (you think the wiring looks bad on a xx, you should try strip the loom on a range rover vouge EFI), any how cleaned it up with a brass suede brush the thing started first time!.
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Postby bezzer » Sat Sep 18, 2004 8:50 pm

You coming to the BMF Simone so I can show you how to use a macro lens in a place where the sun don't shine?? :twisted)
It's not my fix BTW, Wobbs posted about it originally a year or two back when his was replaced, I've just documented it as a "how to" and for information of the poor saps who may get caught out if theirs play up outisde the warranty.
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Postby Simon S » Sat Sep 18, 2004 9:09 pm

Might do if the weathers ok chaps :mrgreen:
Dont think i will bring the macro lens then Bezzer :oops)
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Postby Bristle Hound » Tue Sep 21, 2004 5:35 pm

Has it sorted the problem then Bez ? :?
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Postby bezzer » Tue Sep 21, 2004 10:34 pm

Seems to have worked, 220 miles to the BMF and back, running perfect not a flicker from the FI, fingers crossed it's sorted :thumbsup)
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Postby Bristle Hound » Tue Sep 21, 2004 10:51 pm

:thumbsup)
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got it taped!

Postby geecee » Thu Sep 23, 2004 7:56 pm

:) good article bezzer on waterproofing that connector block, also have a '99 bird, no problems so far. bike is garaged and not used too much in wet.
do you think this potential problem for all 'birds of this vintage? what are first signs of a problem?
am trying to decide, should I pull out the wiring & tape, 'just in case', what do you think :?
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Postby bezzer » Thu Sep 23, 2004 8:58 pm

I've been a "fair weather biker" with the bird, it's not got wet that often so even when Wobbs originally suggested checking it out I didn't bother. I would certainly recommend it now though, when it first happened it did cut out..on the way to a ride out in the outside lane of the M1 :D frightened me to death.
Starts with the FI light flickering and you can get a misfire or it cuts out. You don't know if you're going to just have the light flickering or if it will cut out at the wrong time and one day it will give up permanently.
It's easy enough, get it done, waterproofed and moved from the stupid place they've put it to give you peace of mind if nothing else, every 1999-2000 WILL suffer at some stage.
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Postby Shuggie » Thu Sep 23, 2004 10:40 pm

Top man Bez, I've printed it out and its on the 'To Do' pile for the coming months :notworthy) :wink)
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Postby geecee » Fri Sep 24, 2004 1:59 pm

:ride) thanks for reply, looks like a winter job...........bloody good advice
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Postby Valentino » Wed Sep 29, 2004 10:11 pm

I have just applied the fix to my Bird. It really was very simple to do - the only time consuming part was in seperating the block - this toook nearly 15 mins. the rest took around 1.5 hours plus drying out time(the block not me) :roll)
I'll be testing it this weekend to see if it the FI light comes on - luckily it should be wet on Sunday so it will be a good test.
Thanks to Bezzer and Wobbs for this. If it works it has saved me a fortune
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Postby duncan » Thu Sep 30, 2004 7:39 pm

I will give it a go over winter ,,,,,,but if it all turns to sheeeeeeyite its not my fault !
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Postby STELLA KING » Mon Oct 04, 2004 6:21 pm

Just joined the site,i went to wales at the weekend stoped off at panderosa when i was ready for leaving the FI light didn't go out and the green key light stayed on,hence the bike would not start,
after the rac brought me home i have found that the wiring you all were reffering to is not covered properley and it is all covered in white ****,
i have contacted my dealer and they are coming to pick it up,
my blackbird is a 2000 model and the warrenty has just ran out,anyone got any advice
Cheers.
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Postby Gizzit » Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:22 pm

STELLA KING wrote:Just joined the site,i went to wales at the weekend stoped off at panderosa when i was ready for leaving the FI light didn't go out and the green key light stayed on,hence the bike would not start,
after the rac brought me home i have found that the wiring you all were reffering to is not covered properley and it is all covered in white ****,
i have contacted my dealer and they are coming to pick it up,
my blackbird is a 2000 model and the warrenty has just ran out,anyone got any advice
Cheers.


You're in luck dude, the warranty has been extended to 5 years on the wiring loom :D
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Postby Gizzit » Mon Oct 04, 2004 7:23 pm

Valentino wrote:luckily it should be wet on Sunday


Glad someones fookin happy about it :? :banghead) :bigcry:
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